Woodworking Business

You are not logged in. [ Login ] Why log in
(NOTE: Login is not required to post)

job dragging out client holding up completion

4/23/17       
chipbored

Have an interesting situation with one of our jobs.

The job has been a nightmare from the start. Difficult customer, not understanding the shop drawings we have provided and discussed. Second guessing their own design decisions after the fact....the list goes on. I did them a lot of favours!

We got the job to a point where there were just a few things left to do, we were waiting for client decisions. They held out payment and I pushed hard and said pay your bill as I have finished 99% of your job months ago, leave a $250 retainer on the job until we completely finish. They did this and then a year went by.

We went back after about a year and of course they started picking issues, generally small design issues. I got my back up and said it's not fair that they have been looking at these things for a year and made an issue of them now.

We are now at a point where we have a list of things to fix. All parts ready to go and I want to get out there get it done so I can get their crap out of my factory. Wipe the job off my list and move on. It's not about the money anymore I just want the deal done.

I have made contact and said now is the opportunity to get this stuff done before we get busy and it can't be done for months. No response so I escalated and said I'll drop off the materials and wave the remaining $250 and they can take care of it themselves. I was hoping that would spur them on and I could fill a gap while we are quiet.

They said now is not the time and they will wait till we are available and they are ready. If history repeats. when they are ready they will just continually pester me until I go there and I'm sure it will be when were flat out.

I'm totally over it but don't really know what to say. I have never experienced a customer like it.

Keep in mind I have nothing in my paperwork to describe how we deal with this situation. Of course I am going to put something in for future purposes but I'm still left dealing with this one.

Any advise or past experience would be great. Thankyou.

4/23/17       #2: job dragging out client holding up ...
Leo G

Breach of contract for them.

4/23/17       #3: job dragging out client holding up ...
Pat Gilbert

No matter what this sort of thing is going to happen.

Choose your customers carefully. This is where your policy needs to be.

I asked a buddy of mine who's shop had been in business since the late 50s, why they didn't have this sort of trouble.

They pretty much worked along the coast in one of the highest dig areas in the US. Their main customer was the go to contractor for this area. He would interview the customers as part of the bids, houses in the 8 figure range. Through this interview they could determine if the person was going to be trouble and would then give them a very long estimate of time or cost, in order to discourage them.

Beyond that the usual lien process.

Another tactic I have heard of is to find the sweet spot in the size of the jobs. i.e. ultra jobs are too fussy, the one that are high end but not to the ultra level puts the people in a different mind set and don't have the time to screw around.

Commercial work is a different deal to which the only answer is perfecting the lien.

4/24/17       #4: job dragging out client holding up ...
Economics 101

You could write them a very nice letter explaining that if they don't care about finishing their job on some sort of timely basis, how can you possibly do so?

You could tell them that their parts have been ready for a long time and you'll have to start charging them for storage.

You could tell them that if they continue to jerk you around (stated nicely, of course) you'll turn the matter over to your lawyer.

Better yet, just call your lawyer and have him send a nice $100 letter outlining your position.

That simplifies everything and lets them know that you're done screwing around with their year-old nonsense.

4/24/17       #5: job dragging out client holding up ...
Matt Peterson

Chipbored,

If you have 99% of the money and they are dragging out the completion of the project, then the hat you take off when you get to work is the appropriate hat for the situation. We never know what is going on in a customers life. We are not like a restaurant that only take a portion of someone day with our service. Our services often takes weeks to complete and the customer deals with it for years.
I have had many customers that have drawn out jobs for over a year. One was an antique restoration that sat in my shop completed for 8 months. I was unable to get in contact with the customer and when I could not leave a message I was thinking of finding a buyer. One day I get a call form the customer, she was apologizing left and right. She had been out of the country dealing with her father dying and did not have internet of phone service. As soon as she got back to civilization she got 9 months of emails and when she got home half of the voice messages were from me. She paid her bill and gave me a storage fee.
I have one customer right now that was to be a kitchen, bathroom and library remodel. I finished the kitchen and built the doors and drawers for the other two rooms. The kitchen and new doors were paid for and then scheduling the next room became a problem. It turns out the husband is fighting cancer and the treatments and doctors appointments are taking priority. So I do not know if I will ever do the remaining portion of the job. Just knowing why a customer is acting a certain way can change your perspective of what is going on. She is the one that wants the remodel done. However, I know that if she is by herself, the house may be to large to take care of and the job may be canceled.
Sometimes just talking to a customer and telling them your concerns can solve the problem. Tell them you need the storage space, or you spend a lot of time on scheduling and need some direction, you buy supplies in bulk for the month and need to know how much to order, or whatever is getting under your skin. It sounds like you have done more then most of us would do to make the customer happy. I can understand why you are getting upset. But if all your favors are not helping your customer it is just wasted time. Pick up the phone or stop past if it is not out of the way and talk about what is going on. Explain how you want to help but you are also responsible for your business. If the customer cannot help you understand why they are making your life more difficult then it needs to be you will know what you need to do. I would write an email after the meeting/phone conversation documenting the way the meeting went and the agreed path forward.

4/24/17       #6: job dragging out client holding up ...
rich c.

I wouldn't do anything with that customer. Wrap up the work you have left, and store it. No charges, no threats, nothing. Coming up short just $250 isn't all that bad, and no reason to worry and loose sleep over it. Maybe they'll call you, maybe not. Just don't throw away the work you having sitting there. But of course, use the $250 inspire you to learn and rewrite your contract.

4/24/17       #7: job dragging out client holding up ...
Slam Dunk

I agree with rich c. Forget about it until they contact you, then fit it in at your convenience. The bigger question is how to avoid difficult customers in the first place. I have one now, so I'm not exactly the one to give advice except to say that this particular guy gave off enough signals that he was going to be trouble. I knew better, but I'm a builder, and had a job in hand so I took it. The hidden message, for me, is to listen to my gut.


Post a Response
  • Notify me of responses to this thread
  • Subscribe to email updates on this Forum
  • To receive email notification of additions to this forum thread,
    enter your name and email address, and then click the
    "Keep Me Posted" button below.

    Please Note: If you have posted a message or response,
    do not submit this request ... you are already signed up
    to receive notification!

    Your Name:
    E-Mail Address:
    Enter the correct numbers into the field below:
     

    Date of your Birth:



    Return to top of page

    Buy & Sell Exchanges | Forums | Galleries | Site Map

    FORUM GUIDELINES: Please review the guidelines below before posting at WOODWEB's Interactive Message Boards (return to top)

  • WOODWEB is a professional industrial woodworking site. Hobbyist and homeowner woodworking questions are inappropriate.
  • Messages should be kept reasonably short and on topic, relating to the focus of the forum. Responses should relate to the original question.
  • A valid email return address must be included with each message.
  • Advertising is inappropriate. The only exceptions are the Classified Ads Exchange, Machinery Exchange, Lumber Exchange, and Job Opportunities and Services Exchange. When posting listings in these areas, review the posting instructions carefully.
  • Subject lines may be edited for length and clarity.
  • "Cross posting" is not permitted. Choose the best forum for your question, and post your question at one forum only.
  • Messages requesting private responses will be removed - Forums are designed to provide information and assistance for all of our visitors. Private response requests are appropriate at WOODWEB's Exchanges and Job Opportunities and Services.
  • Messages that accuse businesses or individuals of alleged negative actions or behavior are inappropriate since WOODWEB is unable to verify or substantiate the claims.
  • Posts with the intent of soliciting answers to surveys are not appropriate. Contact WOODWEB for more information on initiating a survey.
  • Excessive forum participation by an individual upsets the balance of a healthy forum atmosphere. Individuals who excessively post responses containing marginal content will be considered repeat forum abusers.
  • Responses that initiate or support inappropriate and off-topic discussion of general politics detract from the professional woodworking focus of WOODWEB, and will be removed.
  • Participants are encouraged to use their real name when posting. Intentionally using another persons name is prohibited, and posts of this nature will be removed at WOODWEB's discretion.
  • Comments, questions, or criticisms regarding Forum policies should be directed to WOODWEB's Systems Administrator
    (return to top).

    Carefully review your message before clicking on the "Send Message" button - you will not be able to revise the message once it has been sent.

    You will be notified of responses to the message(s) you posted via email. Be sure to enter your email address correctly.

    WOODWEB's forums are a highly regarded resource for professional woodworkers. Messages and responses that are crafted in a professional and civil manner strengthen this resource. Messages that do not reflect a professional tone reduce the value of our forums.

    Messages are inappropriate when their content: is deemed libelous in nature or is based on rumor, fails to meet basic standards of decorum, contains blatant advertising or inappropriate emphasis on self promotion (return to top).

    Libel:   Posts which defame an individual or organization, or employ a tone which can be viewed as malicious in nature. Words, pictures, or cartoons which expose a person or organization to public hatred, shame, disgrace, or ridicule, or induce an ill opinion of a person or organization, are libelous.

    Improper Decorum:   Posts which are profane, inciting, disrespectful or uncivil in tone, or maliciously worded. This also includes the venting of unsubstantiated opinions. Such messages do little to illuminate a given topic, and often have the opposite effect. Constructive criticism is acceptable (return to top).

    Advertising:   The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not an advertising venue. Companies participating in a Forum discussion should provide specific answers to posted questions. WOODWEB suggests that businesses include an appropriately crafted signature in order to identify their company. A well meaning post that seems to be on-topic but contains a product reference may do your business more harm than good in the Forum environment. Forum users may perceive your references to specific products as unsolicited advertising (spam) and consciously avoid your web site or services. A well-crafted signature is an appropriate way to advertise your services that will not offend potential customers. Signatures should be limited to 4-6 lines, and may contain information that identifies the type of business you're in, your URL and email address (return to top).

    Repeated Forum Abuse: Forum participants who repeatedly fail to follow WOODWEB's Forum Guidelines may encounter difficulty when attempting to post messages.

    There are often situations when the original message asks for opinions: "What is the best widget for my type of shop?". To a certain extent, the person posting the message is responsible for including specific questions within the message. An open ended question (like the one above) invites responses that may read as sales pitches. WOODWEB suggests that companies responding to such a question provide detailed and substantive replies rather than responses that read as a one-sided product promotion. It has been WOODWEB's experience that substantive responses are held in higher regard by our readers (return to top).

    The staff of WOODWEB assume no responsibility for the accuracy, content, or outcome of any posting transmitted at WOODWEB's Message Boards. Participants should undertake the use of machinery, materials and methods discussed at WOODWEB's Message Boards after considerate evaluation, and at their own risk. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages it deems inappropriate. (return to top)


  • Forum Posting Help
    Your Name The name you enter in this field will be the name that appears with your post or response (return to form).
    Your Website Personal or business website links must point to the author's website. Inappropriate links will be removed without notice, and at WOODWEB's sole discretion. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    E-Mail Address Your e-mail address will not be publicly viewable. Forum participants will be able to contact you using a contact link (included with your post) that is substituted for your actual address. You must include a valid email address in this field. (return to form)
    Subject Subject may be edited for length and clarity. Subject lines should provide an indication of the content of your post. (return to form)
    Thread Related Link and Image Guidelines Thread Related Links posted at WOODWEB's Forums and Exchanges should point to locations that provide supporting information for the topic being discussed in the current message thread. The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not to serve as an advertising venue. A Thread Related Link that directs visitors to an area with inappropriate content will be removed. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links or images it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    Thread Related File Uploads Thread Related Files posted at WOODWEB's Forums and Exchanges should provide supporting information for the topic being discussed in the current message thread. Video Files: acceptable video formats are: .MOV .AVI .WMV .MPEG .MPG .MP4 (Image Upload Tips)   If you encounter any difficulty when uploading video files, E-mail WOODWEB for assistance. The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not to serve as an advertising venue. A Thread Related File that contains inappropriate content will be removed, and uploaded files that are not directly related to the message thread will be removed. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links, files, or images it deems inappropriate. (return to form)