Safety Speed Cut Thermwood Corporation ECabinet Systems

Cabinetmaking

You are not logged in. [ Login ] Why log in
(NOTE: Login is not required to post)

Production box miter cutting

7/15/16       
Ian Hawthorne Member

Website: http://www.ianhawthorne.com

Hi Folks

I am looking for a quick and accurate way to produce miters for production runs of jewellery boxes that will be made from veneered MDF? I have tried the tablesaw with ok results but can be time consumming to setup each time and also means the saw is then tied up with this job.

Thanks Ian

7/15/16       #2: Production box miter cutting ...
rich c.

Look for miter fold/V-groover machinery.

7/15/16       #3: Production box miter cutting ...
rich c.

Look for miter fold/V-groover machinery.

7/15/16       #4: Production box miter cutting ...
Dustin orth

Website: http://customwoodmontrose.com

Have you tried using a shaper? I have a tilting shaper that I do miters on, works way better than any table saw. Normally I do longer pieces with a power feed but you could do shorter with either a sled or sliding table.

7/16/16       #5: Production box miter cutting ...
Ian Hawthorne Member

Thanks for the replies - the miter fold machine looks great but I have limited space and these look big! might try some mitre fold tests with a bit and my milling machine, slow but if the results are good then perhaps a CNC router.

Ian

7/16/16       #6: Production box miter cutting ...
David R Sochar

Guillotine. Foot operated, often used for clean, very accurate miters for picture frames and glass stops. Quiet, smooth and fast with a mitered length guage for repeat cuts.

I just happen to have a like new Morso that I am trying to sell.....

7/16/16       #7: Production box miter cutting ...
Joel

A well tuned radial armsaw with an appropriate blade and a stop would make short work of this. Don't expect to throw a GP blade on a $50 craftsman saw and get good results though. Nothing wrong with craftsman they just need tuning.

7/17/16       #8: Production box miter cutting ...
Larry

Cutting miter folds with a Vee bit isn't the greatest if that's what you are considering one a CNC router. The point has not cutting action and just plows. If you get a router for this job you will want a tiling aggregate so the bit is cutting over it's entire area. A straight bit held at 45 degrees. The router offers the same advantages as the miter fold machine in that the reference surface of the machine and panel is the same.
I've done miter folds on the router with the V bit, but the veneer wants to fracture at the very place where you want it perfect. Ideally, you put the tape on before cutting.

7/18/16       #9: Production box miter cutting ...
Ian Hawthorne Member

I produced some test cuts with a miter fold bit using my milling machine and with the depth set to 0.1mm about the spoil board it work very well! ok slow to produce on a mill but with a CNC it should work well>

Thanks Ian

7/18/16       #10: Production box miter cutting ...
Pat Gilbert

"but with a CNC it should work well"

No it won't, reread Larry's post.

7/18/16       #11: Production box miter cutting ...
Ian Hawthorne Member

"No it won't, reread Larry's post."

I understand his post but can you explain why it worked on a milling machine?

7/18/16       #12: Production box miter cutting ...
Pat Gilbert

Because you did not do enough to dull the point. Which is basically pushing the material out of the way at the point.

7/18/16       #13: Production box miter cutting ...
Ian Hawthorne Member

Ok understood - but how about a long life PCD insert surely that would keep its edge longer?

7/18/16       #14: Production box miter cutting ...
Pat Gilbert

No, the problem is still the same, the circumference of the router bit at the point is zero.

7/18/16       #15: Production box miter cutting ...
Ian Hawthorne Member

Ok so either replace the tips every so many or go through to the spoil board by a few mm keeping the tip out of the work. Of course this means it has to be taped after but no a big problem.

7/18/16       #16: Production box miter cutting ...
Pat Gilbert

The problem is glue squeeze out on the face.

There is this, don't know anything about it.

Possible Alternative

7/18/16       #17: Production box miter cutting ...
Ian Hawthorne Member

Squeeze out won't be a problem as I have eliminated it with the method I use. The saw blade looks good but could be a year before it goes to market.

7/18/16       #18: Production box miter cutting ...
Joel

Am I reading this right? You have some jewelry boxes to build and you got out the Bridgeport? I don't get it. Is your chopsaw busted?

7/18/16       #19: Production box miter cutting ...
Ian Hawthorne Member

"I don't get it. Is your chopsaw busted?"

I would be keen to see how you fit a miter fold bit to a chopsaw!!

7/18/16       #20: Production box miter cutting ...
Pat Gilbert

I wonder if you could build a fixture for doing this vertically, so you could use a V tipped saw blade on your Bridgeport?

Ok I'm not going to think about this anymore it is your problem.

7/18/16       #21: Production box miter cutting ...
Joel

Cut 45 degree angles, put a piece of packing tape on the face of the seam, apply glue. Done! Never seen one fail.

7/18/16       #22: Production box miter cutting ...
Kevin Jenness

Many years ago there was a Fine Woodworking article on this subject in which the author used a beefed up radial arm saw (the guide arm was braced with 45's to the table) with a custom 45 degree groover to produce electronic instrument cases. He cut not quite through the veneer and reinforced the back with tape before folding up the boxes. If you have room that would be an effective solution that you could leave set up. A good stop system would be necessary.

For infrequent short runs and limited space I would stick with the tablesaw or shaper.

7/18/16       #23: Production box miter cutting ...
Pat Gilbert

"the guide arm was braced with 45's to the table"

What does that mean?

7/18/16       #24: Production box miter cutting ...
Kevin Jenness

That means the the front end of the overhead arm of the saw was braced by a pair of stout steel angles welded or bolted to the base in order to hold it in a fixed position with no flex. It was a serious setup, not an amateur affair. If I can find the article I will post the particulars.

7/19/16       #25: Production box miter cutting ...
Kevin Jenness

"Radial Saw Meets Computer", Fine Woodworking #40 pp.98-9. The machine was set up with a moving vacuum table controlled by a computer to locate the v-grooves and a hydraulic/pneumatic system to move the saw head. Very similar to a cnc with an aggregate head but less versatile. Worth a look if you can locate a copy of the May/June 1983 issue- it doesn't seem to be available online.


Post a Response
  • Notify me of responses to this thread
  • Subscribe to email updates on this Forum
  • To receive email notification of additions to this forum thread,
    enter your name and email address, and then click the
    "Keep Me Posted" button below.

    Please Note: If you have posted a message or response,
    do not submit this request ... you are already signed up
    to receive notification!

    Your Name:
    E-Mail Address:
    Enter the correct numbers into the field below:
     

    Date of your Birth:



    Return to top of page

    Buy & Sell Exchanges | Forums | Galleries | Site Map

    FORUM GUIDELINES: Please review the guidelines below before posting at WOODWEB's Interactive Message Boards (return to top)

  • WOODWEB is a professional industrial woodworking site. Hobbyist and homeowner woodworking questions are inappropriate.
  • Messages should be kept reasonably short and on topic, relating to the focus of the forum. Responses should relate to the original question.
  • A valid email return address must be included with each message.
  • Advertising is inappropriate. The only exceptions are the Classified Ads Exchange, Machinery Exchange, Lumber Exchange, and Job Opportunities and Services Exchange. When posting listings in these areas, review the posting instructions carefully.
  • Subject lines may be edited for length and clarity.
  • "Cross posting" is not permitted. Choose the best forum for your question, and post your question at one forum only.
  • Messages requesting private responses will be removed - Forums are designed to provide information and assistance for all of our visitors. Private response requests are appropriate at WOODWEB's Exchanges and Job Opportunities and Services.
  • Messages that accuse businesses or individuals of alleged negative actions or behavior are inappropriate since WOODWEB is unable to verify or substantiate the claims.
  • Posts with the intent of soliciting answers to surveys are not appropriate. Contact WOODWEB for more information on initiating a survey.
  • Excessive forum participation by an individual upsets the balance of a healthy forum atmosphere. Individuals who excessively post responses containing marginal content will be considered repeat forum abusers.
  • Responses that initiate or support inappropriate and off-topic discussion of general politics detract from the professional woodworking focus of WOODWEB, and will be removed.
  • Participants are encouraged to use their real name when posting. Intentionally using another persons name is prohibited, and posts of this nature will be removed at WOODWEB's discretion.
  • Comments, questions, or criticisms regarding Forum policies should be directed to WOODWEB's Systems Administrator
    (return to top).

    Carefully review your message before clicking on the "Send Message" button - you will not be able to revise the message once it has been sent.

    You will be notified of responses to the message(s) you posted via email. Be sure to enter your email address correctly.

    WOODWEB's forums are a highly regarded resource for professional woodworkers. Messages and responses that are crafted in a professional and civil manner strengthen this resource. Messages that do not reflect a professional tone reduce the value of our forums.

    Messages are inappropriate when their content: is deemed libelous in nature or is based on rumor, fails to meet basic standards of decorum, contains blatant advertising or inappropriate emphasis on self promotion (return to top).

    Libel:   Posts which defame an individual or organization, or employ a tone which can be viewed as malicious in nature. Words, pictures, or cartoons which expose a person or organization to public hatred, shame, disgrace, or ridicule, or induce an ill opinion of a person or organization, are libelous.

    Improper Decorum:   Posts which are profane, inciting, disrespectful or uncivil in tone, or maliciously worded. This also includes the venting of unsubstantiated opinions. Such messages do little to illuminate a given topic, and often have the opposite effect. Constructive criticism is acceptable (return to top).

    Advertising:   The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not an advertising venue. Companies participating in a Forum discussion should provide specific answers to posted questions. WOODWEB suggests that businesses include an appropriately crafted signature in order to identify their company. A well meaning post that seems to be on-topic but contains a product reference may do your business more harm than good in the Forum environment. Forum users may perceive your references to specific products as unsolicited advertising (spam) and consciously avoid your web site or services. A well-crafted signature is an appropriate way to advertise your services that will not offend potential customers. Signatures should be limited to 4-6 lines, and may contain information that identifies the type of business you're in, your URL and email address (return to top).

    Repeated Forum Abuse: Forum participants who repeatedly fail to follow WOODWEB's Forum Guidelines may encounter difficulty when attempting to post messages.

    There are often situations when the original message asks for opinions: "What is the best widget for my type of shop?". To a certain extent, the person posting the message is responsible for including specific questions within the message. An open ended question (like the one above) invites responses that may read as sales pitches. WOODWEB suggests that companies responding to such a question provide detailed and substantive replies rather than responses that read as a one-sided product promotion. It has been WOODWEB's experience that substantive responses are held in higher regard by our readers (return to top).

    The staff of WOODWEB assume no responsibility for the accuracy, content, or outcome of any posting transmitted at WOODWEB's Message Boards. Participants should undertake the use of machinery, materials and methods discussed at WOODWEB's Message Boards after considerate evaluation, and at their own risk. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages it deems inappropriate. (return to top)


  • Forum Posting Help
    Your Name The name you enter in this field will be the name that appears with your post or response (return to form).
    Your Website Personal or business website links must point to the author's website. Inappropriate links will be removed without notice, and at WOODWEB's sole discretion. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    E-Mail Address Your e-mail address will not be publicly viewable. Forum participants will be able to contact you using a contact link (included with your post) that is substituted for your actual address. You must include a valid email address in this field. (return to form)
    Subject Subject may be edited for length and clarity. Subject lines should provide an indication of the content of your post. (return to form)
    Thread Related Link and Image Guidelines Thread Related Links posted at WOODWEB's Forums and Exchanges should point to locations that provide supporting information for the topic being discussed in the current message thread. The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not to serve as an advertising venue. A Thread Related Link that directs visitors to an area with inappropriate content will be removed. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links or images it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    Thread Related File Uploads Thread Related Files posted at WOODWEB's Forums and Exchanges should provide supporting information for the topic being discussed in the current message thread. Video Files: acceptable video formats are: .MOV .AVI .WMV .MPEG .MPG .MP4 (Image Upload Tips)   If you encounter any difficulty when uploading video files, E-mail WOODWEB for assistance. The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not to serve as an advertising venue. A Thread Related File that contains inappropriate content will be removed, and uploaded files that are not directly related to the message thread will be removed. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links, files, or images it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    Limtech Industries, Inc. Lamello