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Subject: Re: moulder hold down options

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Message Thread:

moulder hold down options

12/31/14       
shaner

I am looking for some help on how to make up custom hold downs after final top head on a moulder as it comes out. I have lots of different profiles that require special hold downs and seems like the ones I have made to help hold profile down so I end up with some light chatter unless I crank it down tighter.
So looking for ideas on how other make up custom hold downs or are you using the reverse cut outs from the cnc template maker machine where it is made out of a solid plastic material. Would like something to can be used for multiple profiles if possible or if I need to make 1 for each profile that is needed. Please include pictures if possible or links to view ideas. Thanks to anyone who has some advice on this subject!!

1/2/15       #2: moulder hold down options ...
Rob

A good low budget solution is a combination of a modified steel shoe and shop made pads and rails.

You will need to have a steel shoe fabricated to plug in to your existing assembly, my example is for a Weinig Molder. The shoe is 25mm thick vs the 40mm of a standard shoe. You will also need to have rows of holes (not shown), countersunk at top, drilled through it for attaching the bottom wood pad. The wood pad will make up the difference of the full thickness of the factory shoe. This will allow you to use your counters if you have them.

The pad will pick up the thickest part of the molding (minimum radius). You need only to measure the offset or the depth of cut between the two points, mill out a rail the same thickness and pin or screw it to the wood pad above, catching the lower point of the molding. In most cases a simple square rail as shown will work, however you can certainly shape them to rounds or “v”s etc. as need be.

Note: If your machine is a weinig they should have the plates in stock.
Weinig also has a cassette system which is excellent if you can afford it- you can contact them for more info.


View higher quality, full size image (2560 X 1319)


View higher quality, full size image (2560 X 1319)

1/2/15       #3: moulder hold down options ...
Steve

Shaner,

There is a variety of ways to do what you are asking.
Weinig make a two step pressure shoe which would help for some profiles.

Rob's suggestion is also a good one.

Solid plastic pressure shoes are also a good idea if the profile doesn't have many high spots. They can be expensive to make however.

Rob is also referring to a infinite reverse pressure shoe. You can google it. The company that makes them won an award a few years ago. I saw one on Ebay recently. As for how well they work. I don't know. I have never come across anyone that has used one. Maybe some one here has and will comment.

1/2/15       #4: moulder hold down options ...
Russ

Website: http://www.mirror-reflections.com

Shaner You might want to read this recent article we wrote on how to make a custom pressure shoe. It gives you step by step instructions on how to make these shoes. The other two suggestions are also great ones that have a proven success rate. Whatever you decide they will all work well Happy new Year to all. Rob, good to see you still posting your information is always top notch quality.

Article

1/2/15       #5: moulder hold down options ...
shaner

Perfect. That really helps. I have tried a few ways on my own but never seem to work as well as I want.
I will also contact Weinig to just see what they have and costs.
Pretty sure making my own for all the different profiles is way more cost effective.
Russ, I am always on your site and totally just over looked this article because I am pretty sure I have not read this one from you before.
Thanks again for the responses and will get on this soon.

1/3/15       #6: moulder hold down options ...
Rob

Just to clarify, I am not referencing the "infinite reverse shoe" if that is what it is called. I saw that fixture several years ago, thought it was too clever by half- I did not have the opportunity to personally try it so I will leave it at that.

The system I referred to is a sophisticated version of my shop made pad and rails. Weinig has the info if interested.

http://se.weinig.com/C1256FAF0043EEBF/vwContentByKey/W26B7G4E345ALP
AEN/$FILE/accessories_p48.pdf

Weinig Accessories

1/3/15       #7: moulder hold down options ...
Dr.David Rankin

I have used several methods for holding work pieces.

1. Custom nylon pressure shoes
2. Felt pressure shoes(these can be mounted onto either wood or aluminum)
3. Counter hold down(use a piece of the moulding and flip it over onto the running work piece). You can make it a little thicker to improve the rigidity of the hold down.
4. Split shoe. This has a two section ability, so you can hold 2 areas of the moulding.

Be Safe,

Dr. David Rankin

2/3/15       #8: moulder hold down options ...
James D Member

I wanted to chime in and say that the best thing I have found for this is to have whoever makes your knives make a reverse set of knives and template so you can run an exact opposite copy to fit perfectly over your finished piece. This is the same principal as having the nylon shoe made, but doing it this way costs about half as much and you have the ability to make a lifetime supply of reverse shoes! :-) Obviously if it's just a one time run, or something that you hardly make this would probably not be the way to go, but for profiles run often and in long runs, it really is the best way IMHO.

To comment on the Weinig cassette system, save your money!! In theory it sounds good, but for the $10,000 price tag it's not worth it! Aside from the cost, it really does not work like one would think it should. We tried it out quite a bit when we first got it and it never once worked out for us as good as the previously mentioned method. That said, if you must have one, I know where you can get one for substantially cheaper than from Weinig. ;-)

As far as the "infinity reverse pressure shoe", the company that makes them has since went out of business and Weinig owns the patent now. From what I heard, they were in the process of redesigning it so it could be a "plug and play" option for Weinig moulders. They do work pretty awesome though! Here is one on ebay now:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Moulder-molder-weinig-wadkin-scmi-Leadermac-IIda-/
151447573801

 

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