Total Finishing Supplies

Professional Finishing

You are not logged in. [ Login ] Why log in
(NOTE: Login is not required to post)

Finish over Waterlox, other shameful advice needed.

10/16/17       
Matthew Member

I'm a furniture refinisher, but took a job refinishing the ceiling of a 1,800 square foot home a month or so ago. I'm in the middle of what was definitely a mistake, and I need some advice.

It's Knotty Pine.

The majority of the ceilings had terrible water damage... the home was empty for a while and the roof leaked quite a bit. My initial plan to spot repair and bleach these out failed, and I ended up sanding it all back to bare with an orbital. Yeah, I know.

I then stained this to match the parts of the house that were being kept original, and started applying Waterlox. I should have used Shellac, of course, or an airless. I realized this after the first few coats. It's too late for that now.

I have about 7 coats of the Original Sealer on there now. The sheen is just about where it needs to be... but likely could use an extra coat or two to be perfect. I'm applying it with a Lambswool nap and tipping off with a brush.

I'd like to stop the nonsense and just put something thicker on the entire ceiling, including the original sections, that will make the sheen a uniform satin/SG that isn't too shiny, but flat enough to hide some of the imperfections.

Spar Urethane? Ideally I could apply this finish the same way I have applied the Waterlox, thus far... but I'm kinda in too deep and not really sure where to go now.

Ridicule is more than welcome and I would love to hear what a professional would have done. I chose Waterlox because I am familiar with it and believed it offered me the least amount of curveballs... I've never applied it to Pine and the coverage rates on the can were way off compared to what I'm dealing with now. I welcome any and all suggestions and advice, thanks.


View higher quality, full size image (4288 X 2848)


View higher quality, full size image (4288 X 2848)


View higher quality, full size image (4288 X 2848)

10/16/17       #2: Finish over Waterlox, other shamefu ...
Matthew Member

Here are some more pictures...

In the first image, half of this upper level area has been refinished. The line works across the room from the left white wall.

Most concerning to me are some swirl marks which only really became pronounced after sanding between the last couple of coats. They aren't terrible, but they drive me insane. I'm hoping perhaps that I flatter sheen and thicker build will minimize them?

The last image shows the type of water damage. Quite a lot on the main level.


View higher quality, full size image (4288 X 2848)


View higher quality, full size image (4288 X 2848)


View higher quality, full size image (4288 X 2848)

10/16/17       #3: Finish over Waterlox, other shamefu ...
RobertJ

First, let me just say it looks more than acceptable for a Waterlox finish. After the 'sealer' coat, did you apply their 'Satin' Finish as a top coat?

10/16/17       #4: Finish over Waterlox, other shamefu ...
Matthew Member

I toyed with that idea for a while, then ditched it. I was going to batch up a couple gallons of 50/50 Sealer/Satin... my experience with the Satin in the past wasn't great and after speaking with the Waterlox tech guys, I decided I didn't want to risk it.

Basically, I don't want to screw it up on the final coat. My fear was that streaks and lap lines might appear...

10/16/17       #5: Finish over Waterlox, other shamefu ...
david zaret Member

perhaps not the best answer, but you might want to consider arm-r-seal satin. you can pad it on with a thick stain pad, and it's easy to get on without streaks and has a nice sheen. it sticks to waterlox sealer... done it many times before. with a pad, could be a fast process.

something to consider. good luck with the project.

10/16/17       #6: Finish over Waterlox, other shamefu ...
Matthew Member

I had considered that...

Think I run the risk of lap lines? I wonder if it wouldn't be too flat, but I suppose I could thin it a bit?

Hrm.

10/23/17       #7: Finish over Waterlox, other shamefu ...
Matt

Waterlox is a decent finish. I'm not sure you should use Spar as you suggested. It's very dark amber and will certainly shift the color of the wood because of all the phenolic resin they put in it (at least, that's what they used to put in it).

I believe Waterlox is an oil based finish. If you are looking to speed up your curing time, you should be able to go behind it with any other oil based urethane. Regular interior grade is much less amber than Spar.

You might even be able to use "Sherwin Williams Fast Dry Oil Varnish" which cures a good bit faster than polyurethane, and is a decent looking product in it's own right. It's just not as tough as polyurethane. You don't need "tough" on a ceiling.

I sprayed a LOT of book cases with the Fast Dry Oil Varnish. To my eyes it looks as nice as a good precat. Just, scratches easier.


Post a Response
  • Notify me of responses to this thread
  • Subscribe to email updates on this Forum
  • To receive email notification of additions to this forum thread,
    enter your name and email address, and then click the
    "Keep Me Posted" button below.

    Please Note: If you have posted a message or response,
    do not submit this request ... you are already signed up
    to receive notification!

    Your Name:
    E-Mail Address:
    Enter the correct numbers into the field below:
     

    Date of your Birth:



    Return to top of page

    Buy & Sell Exchanges | Forums | Galleries | Site Map

    FORUM GUIDELINES: Please review the guidelines below before posting at WOODWEB's Interactive Message Boards (return to top)

  • WOODWEB is a professional industrial woodworking site. Hobbyist and homeowner woodworking questions are inappropriate.
  • Messages should be kept reasonably short and on topic, relating to the focus of the forum. Responses should relate to the original question.
  • A valid email return address must be included with each message.
  • Advertising is inappropriate. The only exceptions are the Classified Ads Exchange, Machinery Exchange, Lumber Exchange, and Job Opportunities and Services Exchange. When posting listings in these areas, review the posting instructions carefully.
  • Subject lines may be edited for length and clarity.
  • "Cross posting" is not permitted. Choose the best forum for your question, and post your question at one forum only.
  • Messages requesting private responses will be removed - Forums are designed to provide information and assistance for all of our visitors. Private response requests are appropriate at WOODWEB's Exchanges and Job Opportunities and Services.
  • Messages that accuse businesses or individuals of alleged negative actions or behavior are inappropriate since WOODWEB is unable to verify or substantiate the claims.
  • Posts with the intent of soliciting answers to surveys are not appropriate. Contact WOODWEB for more information on initiating a survey.
  • Excessive forum participation by an individual upsets the balance of a healthy forum atmosphere. Individuals who excessively post responses containing marginal content will be considered repeat forum abusers.
  • Responses that initiate or support inappropriate and off-topic discussion of general politics detract from the professional woodworking focus of WOODWEB, and will be removed.
  • Participants are encouraged to use their real name when posting. Intentionally using another persons name is prohibited, and posts of this nature will be removed at WOODWEB's discretion.
  • Comments, questions, or criticisms regarding Forum policies should be directed to WOODWEB's Systems Administrator
    (return to top).

    Carefully review your message before clicking on the "Send Message" button - you will not be able to revise the message once it has been sent.

    You will be notified of responses to the message(s) you posted via email. Be sure to enter your email address correctly.

    WOODWEB's forums are a highly regarded resource for professional woodworkers. Messages and responses that are crafted in a professional and civil manner strengthen this resource. Messages that do not reflect a professional tone reduce the value of our forums.

    Messages are inappropriate when their content: is deemed libelous in nature or is based on rumor, fails to meet basic standards of decorum, contains blatant advertising or inappropriate emphasis on self promotion (return to top).

    Libel:   Posts which defame an individual or organization, or employ a tone which can be viewed as malicious in nature. Words, pictures, or cartoons which expose a person or organization to public hatred, shame, disgrace, or ridicule, or induce an ill opinion of a person or organization, are libelous.

    Improper Decorum:   Posts which are profane, inciting, disrespectful or uncivil in tone, or maliciously worded. This also includes the venting of unsubstantiated opinions. Such messages do little to illuminate a given topic, and often have the opposite effect. Constructive criticism is acceptable (return to top).

    Advertising:   The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not an advertising venue. Companies participating in a Forum discussion should provide specific answers to posted questions. WOODWEB suggests that businesses include an appropriately crafted signature in order to identify their company. A well meaning post that seems to be on-topic but contains a product reference may do your business more harm than good in the Forum environment. Forum users may perceive your references to specific products as unsolicited advertising (spam) and consciously avoid your web site or services. A well-crafted signature is an appropriate way to advertise your services that will not offend potential customers. Signatures should be limited to 4-6 lines, and may contain information that identifies the type of business you're in, your URL and email address (return to top).

    Repeated Forum Abuse: Forum participants who repeatedly fail to follow WOODWEB's Forum Guidelines may encounter difficulty when attempting to post messages.

    There are often situations when the original message asks for opinions: "What is the best widget for my type of shop?". To a certain extent, the person posting the message is responsible for including specific questions within the message. An open ended question (like the one above) invites responses that may read as sales pitches. WOODWEB suggests that companies responding to such a question provide detailed and substantive replies rather than responses that read as a one-sided product promotion. It has been WOODWEB's experience that substantive responses are held in higher regard by our readers (return to top).

    The staff of WOODWEB assume no responsibility for the accuracy, content, or outcome of any posting transmitted at WOODWEB's Message Boards. Participants should undertake the use of machinery, materials and methods discussed at WOODWEB's Message Boards after considerate evaluation, and at their own risk. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages it deems inappropriate. (return to top)


  • Forum Posting Help
    Your Name The name you enter in this field will be the name that appears with your post or response (return to form).
    Your Website Personal or business website links must point to the author's website. Inappropriate links will be removed without notice, and at WOODWEB's sole discretion. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    E-Mail Address Your e-mail address will not be publicly viewable. Forum participants will be able to contact you using a contact link (included with your post) that is substituted for your actual address. You must include a valid email address in this field. (return to form)
    Subject Subject may be edited for length and clarity. Subject lines should provide an indication of the content of your post. (return to form)
    Thread Related Link and Image Guidelines Thread Related Links posted at WOODWEB's Forums and Exchanges should point to locations that provide supporting information for the topic being discussed in the current message thread. The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not to serve as an advertising venue. A Thread Related Link that directs visitors to an area with inappropriate content will be removed. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links or images it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    Thread Related File Uploads Thread Related Files posted at WOODWEB's Forums and Exchanges should provide supporting information for the topic being discussed in the current message thread. Video Files: acceptable video formats are: .MOV .AVI .WMV .MPEG .MPG .MP4 (Image Upload Tips)   If you encounter any difficulty when uploading video files, E-mail WOODWEB for assistance. The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not to serve as an advertising venue. A Thread Related File that contains inappropriate content will be removed, and uploaded files that are not directly related to the message thread will be removed. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links, files, or images it deems inappropriate. (return to form)