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Accounting for twisted cabinet install9/2
Over the years it has become obvious that a "twisted" wall means twisted uppers if you don't shim correctly. My question is how do I determine where to screw cabinet tight to wall and where to start shimming? Having a solid background in finish carpentry an analogy/example of this problem is out of plumb walls when hanging a french door. What I was taught is to pull a string from each corner of jamb and move legs of jamb and when string touches at center the plane of the two jamb legs are now parallel. I'm just wondering if there is such a technique for determining where to start shimming for hanging frameless.
Darn! I actually seriously never thought of the string idea for passage doors. Learn something every day! As for your question I usually run a level all over the wall and find the point that is the furthest in and furthest out of the plane of the wall and then try to fudge the shimming so it is not too obvious. Start fastening near the furthest point out of the wall plane.
running the level all over the wall would be better than what I am doing now, which is pretty much nothing...find level, snap line and hang
You can start by driving a screw at top of cabinet,then check your cabinet if it's plumb.
establish an axis line paralell to the base cabinets. Set pls 180 on said axis line...find the spot on the wall closest to the line, shim cabinets to that point parallel to the axis line. Installing the bases first helps with this method, also I like using a flat cleat on the uppers...they hang but you can pull them or push them as needed. Most projects I am on have established axis lines that each elevation have to be parallel to for coordination for other trades, symmetry etc..
I use lasers to determine what the cabinet needs.
If you plan on putting the cabinet up only one time your options are very limited.
I really dont know why that didnt cross my mind. thanks. I'll try it
I Struggle with this also. I install my base cabinets first so I am considering building a support system that will allow me to assemble all the top cabinet together on the top of these adjustable supports then push them tight to the wall & shim where they don't touch the wall. This is all hypothetical at this point :)
Good idea in theory Gerry.
I like the idea of the track hanging system but have not tried it. There is a new product on the market called a shim screw.
I found the "new" part about Gerry's comment interesting .... it's been decades since I've used them, but the picture at the link he posted is what I've always called "jamb jacks" .... they're absolutely butt-savers when installing french doors - you place them at the hinge area of the jamb where the door stop will cover them up, hang the doors, and tweak the jamb jacks so all reveals are perfect. Best thing - if the house moves, and the doors go out of whack, you pop the stops, tweak the jacks, and look like a hero.
Never used 'em on cabs, though, but in theory, they should work the same.
Now if speed and cost is not an issue, they might just the ticket, but I would sure guess they cost more, and add time
Everything old is new again.
There's also a screw called JAMO that does the same thing.I think it's a little cheaper than GRK product.
What Leo says is true. I, however, just plan on installing twice. Once for scribe lines, and then for good.
Here's a cool trick that I saw on Gary's web site "this is carpentry".
man...what a simple trick (that I learned from baseboard inside corners) but, duh, didnt think of using for this application.
As Dave said, run your long level along the walls and look for humps/dives, as well as identify out-of-plumb extremes. (Just like you do on the floor)
Whenever possible, I like using a rabbeted cleat system that I mill from europly (usually 1/4"x1/4" tongues on 3/4" material.). The advantage of a rabbet vs a "french" cleat with angled surfaces is that subtle variations in flatness won't affect level. It also makes it much easier to pull the uppers back down if necessary.
Good thread, I learned some stuff.
I have recently been running into this problem, I think because now I'm installing in remodels and the houses have settled and tweaked the walls.
Has anyone used the the fasteners Gerry talks about?
As an expedient I like that idea Chaim talks about from Gary Katz.
The laser is a great idea but not everyone uses a laser .
I have used the hanger systems in commercial but with steel studs they are overkill. It would not be efficient to retrofit stock cabinets to them though.