Home » Knowledge Base » Knowledge Base Article What's New  |  Site Map 

 

 
   
   
 
 


Today's
Sponsors:


FlexiCAM

FORDAQ

Forest City Tool

FormWood Industries

Freeborn Tool Company

FS Cruing

FS Tool Corporation

Fuhr International

Fuji Spray

Furniture D Cube

G&M Woodcopy Lathes

Gabbiani Machine

Glue Machinery Corporation

Goby Walnut Products

Granite Road

Great Lakes Kiln Drying Association

Great Northern Lumber

Greco Manufacturing

GreCon

Green Forest Products

GUHDO

Hanson and Leja Lumber Company

CIM-Tech

Clear Lake Lumber

CNC Auto-Motion

CNC Parts Dept.

CNCROUTERSTORE.com

CNT Motion Systems

Colonial Saw

Construction Programs and Results

Construction Recruiters

COOLwoodworkingstuff.com

Copemaster

Cordes Machine

Country Saw & Knife, Inc.

Courmatt International Inc.

CP Adhesives

CraftMaster Manufacturing

CSH Custom Service Hardware Inc.

CTD Machines

Custom Woodworking Business

Cutlist Plus

D.S. Brown Machinery

Dancer Logging

Delle Vedove USA, Inc.

Delmac Machinery Group

Delmhorst Instrument Co.

Delta

Denray Machine

DeVilbiss

Diehl Machines

Direct Source Imports

Dispoz-A-Blade

Diversi-Tech

DMC

DODDS

Don Hall & Associates

Donald Dean and Sons

Doucet Machineries Inc.

Downdrafttable.org

Durable Wood Products

E.W. Tooling Inc.

Eagle America

Eagle Machinery and Repair Co.

EasyCoper Tool Company

ECabinet Systems

Edge-It Edgebanding

Electrophysics

Elias Woodwork & Manufacturing

Elkom North America

Endeavor Hardwoods

EnRoute WOOD

ETemplate Digital Measuring

Eterna Lighting

ETK International

Eurosoft, Inc.

EX-FACTORY

Excel Dowel and Wood Products Inc.

ExpressSander.com

Extrema Machinery

FastCap

FESTOOL

Finish Systems



WOODWEB DISCLAIMS any and all RESPONSIBILITY and LIABILITY for the accuracy and application of the information below. Readers agree to evaluate the significance and limitations of the information provided, and accept full responsibility for the application of this information. Read More ...

Would you like to add information to this article?
Interested in writing or submitting an article?
Have a question about this article?



Stroke, drum and widebelt sanders       What sort of sander is most efficient for a small cabinet shop? July 24, 2001

Question
I have a small cabinet shop and might buy a stroke sander to ease my time on finishing work. I've considered drum sanders, and of course a wide belt. How effective for the money is a stroke sander?

Forum Responses
I don't own one, but I did just purchase an SCMI 43" 2-head segmented sander. Please explain more about what you are sanding and what finish you need to sand to.

Stroke sanders are a cheap alternative, but you may not require one and your needs may be just as easily accomplished with a down draft table and two plain old vibrators or orbitals loaded with 2-3 different grits. A stroke sander will only be able to sand with a single grit loaded at one time. This is the biggest problem with them, as with a wide belt with a single head. Depending on what you're sanding, it's wise to have all of the parts requiring finish sanded with the same grit, as different grits will lead to different colors or shades in the finish process.

I spent the extra money because I want a system with ease of maintenance. With a 2 head and segmented, I can run any type of part that needs to be sanded through one and only one place, with a grit combination that will ensure a proper finish every time.

You always need to consider the worst case scenario and buy the machine best suited for that. There is no sense in buying a 37" single-head only to be faced with a 42" glass cabinet with an oak plywood back. You have to stand next to your investment with a vibrator and two horses blowing dust all over a $20,000 machine you can't use because you bought it with limitations, be they width considerations or sanding through veneer.



From the original questioner:
My operation includes cabinetry, furniture (desks, tables, etc.) and built-ins. 18 months ago I included a Woodmizer sawmill and now have figured grain lumber. It's with these woods that I'm considering developing a more production approach to getting "finish ready".

I hear you about the tall or wide unit that won't fit in the machine. And that's a good observation about the "double grit in one pass" move. A double drum sander 24" is within my reach. I could work around its perimeters if I had more feedback on how well they stand up and how user-friendly they are. In summary, most sanding requirements would be less than 6'-0" tall by 24" wide, usually finished to 150 grit with touch-up sanding as necessary.



I don't know all of the parts you want to sand. There may be some plywood, from what I can figure.

I think you may want to buy two things, a stroke sander and a downdraft table, and make a sanding "cell".



First off, comparing a stroke sander and a wide belt are like a thickness planer and a jointer, not the same.

If I had the space I would have my stroke sander back. There are things it will do that a wide belt won't. The control you have when sanding veneered products is second only to CNC platens of newer wide belts. If you are trying to thickness paneled doors or trim packages, the stroke sander is not very good at this. However, if you are trying to do general sanding, plywood panels and such, it will make you money as compared to the orbital or hand belt sander. I bet you can find a good used stroke sander for under $1000. It will run and run and run. In the end you will need to purchase a wide belt, but you need to start some place.



I had a stroke sander before I got my double drum sander. I used them both for sanding raised panel doors. There was a night and day difference in the volume of work I was able to produce between the two machines. I would definitely go for the double drum over the stroke sander.

I have a 20" 5 hp model that looks similar to the Grizzly 24". I wouldn't bother with a single drum sander because I usually sand with 120 or 100 before finishing up with 150 grit. The double drum does both grits in one process.

I bought mine used and have run thousands of doors and panels through it and have only had to change paper and keep the chain and threaded rods that raise and lower the table clean and well oiled.

I'd recommend to the machine's manufacturer to put an extra drive belt on, as when I try to take too deep a cut, the belt can slip (and I've tightened it as much as I dare).

I usually make two passes on each side of my doors and then take out the cross grain scratches on the rails of each door with my random orbit and then send them off to be finished. I am always amazed at how long the sandpaper lasts--many times longer than the paper on my random orbit or handheld belt sanders.

Yes, I find mine user-friendly. The rolled sandpaper is attached to the drum with velcro and is wrapped on in a spiral pattern. The ends are cut on a taper and are taped down with 3/4" fiberglass tape. Changing the paper on both drums takes maybe 10-20 minutes.



You mention that you are processing figured woods and would like to sand them. We have used a lot of figured maple and cherry through the years and found access to a heavy wide-belt type of sander to be indispensable for preparing those woods for use. Even under optimal conditions you will experience tear-out in your planing operation. A stroke sander is far worse at removing the amount of material necessary to clean up machining defects than a feed-through machine.


The biggest difference between the machines is operator dependence. A stroke sander still requires an operator, and that means quality or time-wasting concerns. A sand-through is a sand-through, so if someone sands through a veneer table top with laminated strips of 1/4 cherry bent into a boat shape around the edges, the project is ruined and it's time to start over.

If you have good operators or you're only doing solid wood, this isn't the biggest concern. But a wide belt is responsible for the quality and the timeframe without any operator intervention, while a stroke still needs a guy to work it in a timeframe and to a certain quality. The 24" Grizzly is kind of on its own, as well.

It's like the analogy between a jointer and a planer. The jointer needs a guy to hold it straight and make sure the bow is up, it's going in the right direction and it isn't tilted. The planer needs a thickness setting and it's finished and propels itself through the machine in a certain timeframe at a certain quality.



From the original questioner:
I believe the drum sander will fill my needs more than the stroke sander.


We have a wide belt, a stroke sander and a down draft table with many orbital sanders. None of them will work with a $6/hr man!

On the wide belt, we usually do a 3 grit process, 60,100,150. Coarse, medium, fine. It takes less than a minute to change paper on a wide belt, so for a real small shop, a single head will work fine. You need about 1 hp per inch of width for a contact drum on the wide belt. The platens on the cheap single-head machine help, but they have considerable limitations.

You will still need to orbit after the wide belt. Cross grain scratches take more effort to get out than you'd think. The stroke sander offers a lot of control, faster stock removal than you would think and, hence, operator judgement. It's also a lot faster than an orbital, but there's that cross grain thing again on frames. That's where the orbital shines.



The comments below were added after this Forum discussion was archived as a Knowledge Base article (add your comment).

Comment from contributor B:
I have had great luck with a semi-automatic stroke sander like the old Curtis hydro-stroke machine. It removes material fast and with a half decent operator it does a great job with small horsepower requirement. This type of machine will sand wider material like a 60" table top. The main limitation is really long material as the table length is only 8'.


Have you reviewed the related Knowledge Base areas below?
  • KnowledgeBase: Business

  • KnowledgeBase: Business: Plant Management

  • KnowledgeBase: Cabinetmaking

  • KnowledgeBase: Cabinetmaking: General

  • KnowledgeBase: Solid Wood Machining

  • KnowledgeBase: Solid Wood Machining: General

  • KnowledgeBase: Knowledge Base




    Would you like to add information to this article? ... Click Here

    If you have a question regarding a Knowledge Base article, your best chance at uncovering an answer is to search the entire Knowledge Base for related articles or to post your question at the appropriate WOODWEB Forum. Before posting your message, be sure to
    review our Forum Guidelines.

    Questions entered in the Knowledge Base Article comment form will not generate responses! A list of WOODWEB Forums can be found at WOODWEB's Site Map.

    When you post your question at the Forum, be sure to include references to the Knowledge Base article that inspired your question. The more information you provide with your question, the better your chances are of receiving responses.

    Return to beginning of article.



    Refer a Friend || Read This Important Information || Site Map || Privacy Policy

    Letters, questions or comments? E-Mail us and let us know what you think. Be sure to review our Frequently Asked Questions page.

    Contact us to discuss advertising or to report problems with this site.

    To report a problem, send an e-mail to our Webmaster

    Copyright © 1996-2008 - WOODWEB ® Inc.
    All rights reserved. No part of this publication may be reproduced in any manner without permission of the Editor.
    Review WOODWEB's Copyright Policy.

    The editors, writers, and staff at WOODWEB try to promote safe practices. What is safe for one woodworker under certain conditions may not be safe for others in different circumstances. Readers should undertake the use of materials and methods discussed at WOODWEB after considerate evaluation, and at their own risk.

    WOODWEB, Inc.
    RR4 Box 265A
    Montrose, PA 18801

    Contact WOODWEB