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California Commercial Cabinets9/15
Hi, for California market,
I posted the exact thread sometime in the past year. Most replies were in the $125 to $200 range. If you're bidding $330/LF for uppers, I'm not too surprised you're losing bids. That's about double what I'm able to get on winning bids, and I'm in California too.
Thank you for your response
Right. Seems a bit odd to combine uppers and lowers into a single LF price, but you do it however you want.
Any shop with a CNC and a bander can easily bang out laminate cabinets at below $330/LF "combined upper/lower".
i have to do it this way because this project has most of the rooms upper and lower running together, so it is a bit faster to come out with a total.
Im not even in your market but if your pricing 330/ft for uppers AND lowers (660/ft of run) Im surprised your still in business.
Even 330/ft for both would seem sky high to me.
The OP is probably Mexican with not so good English. I'm pretty sure what he's saying is $330/LF includes both uppers and lowers. That puts him at $165/LF for either the uppers or lowers. That's reasonable I think.
Logan what is the OP abbreviation,
I charge $900 linear at north America, all cnc output installation included.
Sure you do
Downtown SF A space, highrise
Going broke at $330
There both $1 per lb, at the orchard, they have different density, size, and shipping to fruit stand on the orchard property costs less than to different stores and the Walmart warehouse. Plus some people want all their fruit exactly 3" in diameter so it takes a lot of fruit to find the right piece and costs a bit to sort.
All cars are the same, you get in drive and go somewhere. Some would argue that a Ferrari and a Cadillac and a Toyota are better than a Yugo, yet in the end when maintained they all get you to your destination. I don't know how much cars cost a foot.
Foot prices were developed by GC and developers as a quick way to budget projects, carpet is x$ per square foot, wall is per linear foot, electrical is x per outlet, ceiling is x per sq foot, cabinets just measure the lineal and come up with a budget. If you always build cabinets the same sizes and install is always the same then footage works. I don't know how you account for economies of scale if you are making a 100 of each of the cabinets in the drawing, booking 4 high on a beam saw gets 100 cut pretty quick compared to 1. Construction managers want unit prices so when they make changes they know the range of the cost impact. They don't want the price of beans going up in the middle of the job.
What happens if they move the wall 18" after we install and they want an 18" cabinet and top added on, is it $495?
If you charge $330 a foot and the market is saying that's too much then you either need to lower your price and get more efficient or sell somewhere else, either way you need to know what it costs in time and materials before you can make a price decision and then you could look at a lot of jobs and reverse engineer profitable footage numbers if you want.
I know people that use multipliers of material cost. In the end it takes x dollars to keep the doors open and y dollars to get everything built. If footage pricing works for you then that's fine. I just see so many variations that I am not comfortable with it.
So you are saying we should charge by the pound?
Okay I want everyone to pay attention, for the first time on forums I am going to reveal the most accurate pricing methods we ever used. Unfortunately it lost its value when we went to using PDF drawings but here it is
(wind speed * price of gold * plan weight * best guess fudge factor )
Rain days are the best days to bid.
The secrets to phone call budgets for ball park prices is We use 0 though 9 with commas as needed.
Good luck bidding, remember if you get everything you bid you are either a well oiled machine selling in a non competitive market or you are selling too low.
So yes Pat, sell by the lb, net or gross, before cutting or after it can all be made to work.
Thanks Alan, that certainly clears that up.
No one operating a real business prices by the foot! At least they are not likely to be a business for long. Apples aren't priced that way either!
I always times the material X 3,
The AWI used to have a cost book, it had hundreds of operations and standard run times on a variety of machines, what it didn't have was pricing by the foot.
Labor and material varies if you do custom work that is build to design by others.
If you break your units down with a lot of add ins and deducts I am sure you can make footage pricing work.
How you account for economies of scale, machine setup times, waste factors for different brands of laminate or veneer are up to you.
If your cost with profit is below 330 a foot then you can lower your price, but I would want to know my costs before setting a price per foot. Just because someone else can sell at that price and make money doesn't mean you can.
if you are in business long time, you can measure how thinks work if you don't know how to do i believe you have to register all off these, DCA, AWI, EPA,FSS,OSHA, etc. compliance are here to guide. I also ask fire marshall all the questions about i am scare of to not add more hazardous situation,Town City and States and taxes vary. If my customers don't like my prices i say them go some other states.
For a given volume, you can absolutely price this type of cabinetry by the LF. You guys are making up a bunch of nonsense to make it more complicated than it really is. $330/LF for combined uppers/lowers is about right for a small to medium size job. Talking about how you'd price it with high gloss laminate and solid gold pulls is a sign that you've truly got nothing better to do than put together a hypothetical situation that has nothing to do with the OP's question.