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Arched Door Pivot Hinges ?7/13
I have large upcoming project that will require pivot hinges on large arched exterior doors.
Arched doors are no different from straight doors since the hinges are not set on anything but a true vertical edge.
If the door is a 90 degree arch - a quarter round - mated with a second door to make a half round head, and 8' tall x 3' wide on each door, that means that 3' of the door on the hinge stile will be unsupported. The top hinge will be at 5' and working hard to carry the weight.
The photo shows a heavy Oak door on Rixson offset intermediate hinges for the top two, and a recessed floor mounted offset hydraulic closer. The hinges were sized for the weight of the door, the usage (cycles), and the fact that they were the same in the original door, so they fit the frame just fine. We had to cut it all into the new door, but it went very well.
Rixson makes a good line of pivots, and will have center hung pivots, offset pivots and intermediate pivots.
Thank you David; I wish the doors I will be building were that simple. These will be 4' wide and 12' tall. They want the pivot point to be approx 8" from the jamb so when door opens it will encroach into the opening. Not sure what this is called. They will be for a museum so they will see high traffic. I may need a custom made top pivot.(?)
I see a lot of these pivot doors coming thru lately. They will not be around too long, fads in architecture do not last long. A major reason is that 8" section of door swinging in an unfamiliar manner, with the leverage of a huge door behind it, smashing fingers, cats, or anything that gets in the way. Especially in a public building. You could do a mock up for their insurance carrier - crack a few walnuts... - and see how long it takes before they go back to a more doable solution.
If they are arched tops you will have to have that top pivot custom made. It will also have to have the raise and lower of the pin engineered into it so the doors can be placed and removed. At 12', the upper edge is high enough that you can make a flat landing of sorts for the pin movement and no one will see the accommodations needed. That will be a trick.
Another problem area we found is weatherstripping. If your project is exterior, then get the architects to specify weatherstripping materials and methods.
You may want to go back to the Architect with a RFI on the hinges, and put the burden on him/her. He/she would gladly put it on you, so be careful.
I have been thinking about the mechanics of how an arched door could have a center mounted pivot ( mounted in the center of it's thickness as opposed to an offset pivot that mounts on the corner of the door as in David's previous photo) It seems like the door will hit the jamb as it opens?
Gary - You are right. Sort of. Visualize a segment arched door in a deep jamb - 7" or more. Center it in the opening's width since it is a double acting door, as in a pantry door to Kitchen. As the door opens to 90 degrees, the door head will contact the frame head, preventing 90 degrees or more
One solution we used was a 1-3/4" wide "land", about 1" thick, that ran in the door jamb head, directly above where the closed door would be. The door was 1-3/4" thick. Now that you have warmed up your visualization skills, you can see that the door will easily operate. As it opened, it will clear things handily. But the 'land' up there is a bit odd.... This was for a pantry two-way door on a Bommer Spring hinge, so it all worked well, mechanically and visually.
A real world event that warmed my heart was an old This Old House where Norm and Crew framed up a barrel vault ceiling in a small bathroom. The barrel vault extended out beyond the bath wall. The radius was about 18" and a 180 degrees arc. They all prided themselves on how cool this looked. They added a light jamb, 2 sides and a curved head, and again congratulated themselves. Then they got the door. They honestly all seemed surprised when it would not open, so I wonder how it went down in reality. Did no one catch it until that moment?
As we say around here, I'm glad it wasn't me.
Quite a long time ago we were doing the millwork for a big, expensive house. Arched doors in fake adobe masonry interior & exterior walls. The lady of the house was in charge. She wanted all the doors centered in the 8" thick walls, without jambs! The architect told her it wouldn't work. She came to us and told us we had to make it work. We made a mockup to demonstrate the problem. We ended up making a thick jamb that was just slightly thicker (the other way) than the door and incorporated a stop. She signed the change order. The job site carpenter did a beautiful job of scribing the jambs to the masonry. She didn't like it and refused to pay until we made what she wanted. Lien time! That really pissed her off. General contractor took it to court. Her lawyer negotiated a settlement. I think he could see the problem. That entire job went that way. The house was torn down a few years ago, solid masonry walls in our climate doesn't work! Another of the reasons we only do commercial work.