Woodworking Business

You are not logged in. [ Login ] Why log in
(NOTE: Login is not required to post)

Finding people?

1/26/18       
Karl E Brogger  Member

Website: http://www.sogncabinets.com

What have people been using to find labor?

I find myself in a pickle having about as much work in the first quarter of this year as I did in half of last year, and severely short on help.

I've sent out feelers to everyone I can think of. I've got an ad on Craigslist with zero response.

I spoke with an employment placement agency, and they've got someone in going to meet. I'm not sure how I feel about this approach.

1/26/18       #2: Finding people? ...
rich c.

Employment agency is certainly better than Craigslist. Did you try any temp agencies? Technically a temp is not your employee, so if they don't work out, it doesn't effect your companies history if you fire them.

1/26/18       #3: Finding people? ...
Karl E Brogger  Member

Website: http://www.sogncabinets.com

That's kinda how this works. The guy will be employed by the agency and the agency handles the payroll and worker's compensation for 90 days then I have the option of continuing the same way, or putting him on my payroll. But I can dismiss him at any time and not have to worry about it in that first 90 days.

It's not cheap. 60% in that first 720 hours.

1/27/18       #4: Finding people? ...
Chris Member

Website: https://cuttershare.com

These are perhaps potential resources:

Madison College Cabinetmaking Millwork Program
https://madisoncollege.edu/program/cabinetmaking-millwork

https://madisoncolleg
e.edu/files/gainful-employment/314092.html

http://www.thisiscarpentry.com/2016
/08/12/madison-area-technical-college/

http://woodworkcareer.org/

http://ww
w.woodlinks.com/industry/participate-woodlinks

https://www.wisconsintechconnec
t.com/

https://www.indeed.com/q-Cabinet-l-Minnesota-jobs.html

https://www.g
lassdoor.com/Job/jobs.htm?suggestCount=0&suggestChosen=false&clickSource=
searchBtn&typedKeyword=cabinetmaker&sc.keyword=cabinetmaker&locT=S&am
p;locId=1775&jobType=

All the best!

Madison College Cabinetmaking Millwork

1/27/18       #5: Finding people? ...
ms

Don't forget WOODWEB's Job Exchange - you can post an "Offering Employment" listing and also review the listings there to see if there might be a fit for your needs. Just click on the link below -

Job Exchange

1/27/18       #6: Finding people? ...
finewoodwork Member

In my opinion, CL is a waste of time. I suggest Indeed. When I am looking for skilled workers that is the place I start.

1/27/18       #7: Finding people? ...
cabmaker

I have made a lot of really great hires out of Craigslist.

It's relatively easy to do in my city because we have a local woodworking college with a one year waiting list. I aim my ad at the people on that waiting list. It's a pretty simple sell when you are offering to pay them to learn instead of vice versa.

I don't like hiring people who have been to that woodworking school because they somehow instill in their students an ethic that says it doesn't matter how long things take to make. In school they get three weeks to build an emotionally gratifying router table. In the real world we need that router table in about ten minutes and we're only going to use it for one minute. The schools don't teach urgency.

If you can develop a system to make people useful quickly you will have a very happy employee. These people like success. The more you invest in your training systems the more successful they will be.

1/27/18       #8: Finding people? ...
Karl E Brogger  Member

Website: http://www.sogncabinets.com

"These people like success"

Funny you should mention that. I was chatting with a branch manager for a coffee shop in town just a few days ago. We've got two liberal arts colleges, and a lot of these types of positions are filled by college kids from either of those schools. Some places know how to pick them, and others despite having a great product, I think twice about going there because the help just sucks. The coffee shop seems to run really well though and I asked him how he motivates the younger generation. He said it's all about the dopamine hits that todays kids have been trained to need from social media. They need constant reassurance, and congratulations for doing virtually anything.

Personally, I find that ridiculous. I'm a farm kid. You don't do your job, livestock get hurt, sick, starve or freeze to death. Or a crop doesn't take. It's like the Chris Rock joke about bragging you've never been to jail. You're not supposed to go to jail. And you're supposed to do your job. Anything less than the standards set forth, is not doing your job.

But, if that's what it takes to motivate the trophy generation, then I need to alter my tactics. My motivation growing up was not getting my ass kicked for screwing up.

My thank you to the employee, is the paycheck and limited benefits you receive, and that's how I felt when I worked at other shops. I felt gratitude. As I do when I get paid for a job in my own company. I do like hearing when the builders are happy, but it is more about me knowing where I stand and they aren't out shopping for another cabinet maker.

1/27/18       #9: Finding people? ...
Macks Member

I've had the most success hiring out of our local high school wood shop. Of course I've also invested a lot of time helping to develop the whole program there but that's another story. I'm trying to get some sort of job (to my business) specific training into the curriculum there that a kid could pass and be able to walk right into a job with us perhaps even before they graduate e.g. Summer or after school job.

1/27/18       #10: Finding people? ...
cabmaker

If people on the woodweb had the patience for it this thread could be a launching pad for a discussion of best practices for training people.

We are all going to spend a certain amount of money building drawer boxes next year.

We will spend money training people to do this. We will spend money mopping up from the consequences of poor training and we will spend money building drawer boxes.

This is not a problem for those of us who outsource drawer boxes. For these people substitute some other generic task for drawer boxes. The people we hire are not born intrinsically understanding our systems or processes.

On the other hand we could also embrace the KISS system of production management and don't fix it if it ain't broke. This is probably the best approach for those who already have their rodeo buckle.

1/27/18       #11: Finding people? ...
Mark B Member

Reading the Chris Rock quote cracked me up.

We are in a rural area where access to help is virtually ZERO. If your lucky you will get a kid who shows up and will think running a sander means standing a table mindlessly swiping a sander left to right while your looking at your song queue on your cell phone.

They cant understand why I wont allow music blaring in the shop when someone breaking down material sets the saw to 4.75" instead of 3.75" because they read the wrong side of the tape.

My significant other works for a state agency and they have management training on a regular basis. She has stated consistently that the philosophy in todays business market is that if you can not figure out how to manage this younger generation in a way that "they want to be managed",.. you will have no workforce.

I grew up in the trades where if you were a do-less waste, you got hammers thrown at you, your lunch pail was at the edge of the road and you found your own way home. That would usually happen once (and your done), or none, because you were a worker.

Those days are gone. I have employees now that in off-time conversations about how I came up in the trades, they say "well in my world if someone did that to me it would be a law suit". It makes me want to fire them, or find a reason to run them off, instantly.

Times have changed. Im not arguing in favor of anyone having a hammer thrown at them or being belittled. That was a daily experience for me. I learned very quickly to do anything and everything to move away from that end result as fast as I could and with that it perhaps happened once or twice because I was the odd bird who busted their hump.

We have tried the temp, we have tried the state agency hiring. And I will tell you the best thing for us, though its not a long term solution, is hiring WOTC eligible. Vets, Newly Released Felons, etc..

It sounds awful but you have a captive and appreciative workforce. You get a tax break. Its worth a look.

1/29/18       #12: Finding people? ...
David R Sochar Member

I learned when running a 15 man shop that new hires had to go thru a few steps before they were ready for prime time. We had a 5 man pre-hung door shop, and the bottom job was pulling doors, and cutting casing. Neither was easy, but they were repetitive. By noon, we know if we had a keeper or not.

Then they'd have to go thru 2-3 other positions in the door shop (more repetition). If they lived thru this, then they would be good help for the other tasks, mostly machine operators. Occasionally we would find a self starter, a thinker, a mechanic, and we could move them into the top tier, custom work. Some preferred to stay where they were. We did need machine operators that liked their job, and we appreciated them quite a bit.

In my own shop (all custom, little repetition), I would explain that we are going to fast track someone to success. Once they learned fork lift basics, the corners of their hat were bent down, with some fanfare. But the primary thing they learned was reading a cut list and then how to S4S lumber. This would take 2 weeks to go thru each machine with a trainer, but by then we knew. Once they could produce good S4S reliably, then they would work thru parts of cut lists and progressively larger lists. You could see the confidence build. It was a good thing.

I also involved the seasoned workers in informal evaluations. They knew that a good coworker was good for all of us, so they did try to be accurate. More than anything, they wanted to be fair.

2/2/18       #13: Finding people? ...
Larry

I don't have an answer but feel your pain. There is an unemployment rate here of 2.1%. Letting your employees know you are looking for help sometimes works. Whatever you do, don't keep a poor employee for over a couple of days. Attitude counts far more than experience. A great way to sort prospective employees is leading them into talking about their last couple of jobs.


Post a Response
  • Notify me of responses to this thread
  • Subscribe to email updates on this Forum
  • To receive email notification of additions to this forum thread,
    enter your name and email address, and then click the
    "Keep Me Posted" button below.

    Please Note: If you have posted a message or response,
    do not submit this request ... you are already signed up
    to receive notification!

    Your Name:
    E-Mail Address:
    Enter the correct numbers into the field below:
     

    Date of your Birth:



    Return to top of page

    Buy & Sell Exchanges | Forums | Galleries | Site Map

    FORUM GUIDELINES: Please review the guidelines below before posting at WOODWEB's Interactive Message Boards (return to top)

  • WOODWEB is a professional industrial woodworking site. Hobbyist and homeowner woodworking questions are inappropriate.
  • Messages should be kept reasonably short and on topic, relating to the focus of the forum. Responses should relate to the original question.
  • A valid email return address must be included with each message.
  • Advertising is inappropriate. The only exceptions are the Classified Ads Exchange, Machinery Exchange, Lumber Exchange, and Job Opportunities and Services Exchange. When posting listings in these areas, review the posting instructions carefully.
  • Subject lines may be edited for length and clarity.
  • "Cross posting" is not permitted. Choose the best forum for your question, and post your question at one forum only.
  • Messages requesting private responses will be removed - Forums are designed to provide information and assistance for all of our visitors. Private response requests are appropriate at WOODWEB's Exchanges and Job Opportunities and Services.
  • Messages that accuse businesses or individuals of alleged negative actions or behavior are inappropriate since WOODWEB is unable to verify or substantiate the claims.
  • Posts with the intent of soliciting answers to surveys are not appropriate. Contact WOODWEB for more information on initiating a survey.
  • Excessive forum participation by an individual upsets the balance of a healthy forum atmosphere. Individuals who excessively post responses containing marginal content will be considered repeat forum abusers.
  • Responses that initiate or support inappropriate and off-topic discussion of general politics detract from the professional woodworking focus of WOODWEB, and will be removed.
  • Participants are encouraged to use their real name when posting. Intentionally using another persons name is prohibited, and posts of this nature will be removed at WOODWEB's discretion.
  • Comments, questions, or criticisms regarding Forum policies should be directed to WOODWEB's Systems Administrator
    (return to top).

    Carefully review your message before clicking on the "Send Message" button - you will not be able to revise the message once it has been sent.

    You will be notified of responses to the message(s) you posted via email. Be sure to enter your email address correctly.

    WOODWEB's forums are a highly regarded resource for professional woodworkers. Messages and responses that are crafted in a professional and civil manner strengthen this resource. Messages that do not reflect a professional tone reduce the value of our forums.

    Messages are inappropriate when their content: is deemed libelous in nature or is based on rumor, fails to meet basic standards of decorum, contains blatant advertising or inappropriate emphasis on self promotion (return to top).

    Libel:   Posts which defame an individual or organization, or employ a tone which can be viewed as malicious in nature. Words, pictures, or cartoons which expose a person or organization to public hatred, shame, disgrace, or ridicule, or induce an ill opinion of a person or organization, are libelous.

    Improper Decorum:   Posts which are profane, inciting, disrespectful or uncivil in tone, or maliciously worded. This also includes the venting of unsubstantiated opinions. Such messages do little to illuminate a given topic, and often have the opposite effect. Constructive criticism is acceptable (return to top).

    Advertising:   The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not an advertising venue. Companies participating in a Forum discussion should provide specific answers to posted questions. WOODWEB suggests that businesses include an appropriately crafted signature in order to identify their company. A well meaning post that seems to be on-topic but contains a product reference may do your business more harm than good in the Forum environment. Forum users may perceive your references to specific products as unsolicited advertising (spam) and consciously avoid your web site or services. A well-crafted signature is an appropriate way to advertise your services that will not offend potential customers. Signatures should be limited to 4-6 lines, and may contain information that identifies the type of business you're in, your URL and email address (return to top).

    Repeated Forum Abuse: Forum participants who repeatedly fail to follow WOODWEB's Forum Guidelines may encounter difficulty when attempting to post messages.

    There are often situations when the original message asks for opinions: "What is the best widget for my type of shop?". To a certain extent, the person posting the message is responsible for including specific questions within the message. An open ended question (like the one above) invites responses that may read as sales pitches. WOODWEB suggests that companies responding to such a question provide detailed and substantive replies rather than responses that read as a one-sided product promotion. It has been WOODWEB's experience that substantive responses are held in higher regard by our readers (return to top).

    The staff of WOODWEB assume no responsibility for the accuracy, content, or outcome of any posting transmitted at WOODWEB's Message Boards. Participants should undertake the use of machinery, materials and methods discussed at WOODWEB's Message Boards after considerate evaluation, and at their own risk. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages it deems inappropriate. (return to top)


  • Forum Posting Help
    Your Name The name you enter in this field will be the name that appears with your post or response (return to form).
    Your Website Personal or business website links must point to the author's website. Inappropriate links will be removed without notice, and at WOODWEB's sole discretion. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    E-Mail Address Your e-mail address will not be publicly viewable. Forum participants will be able to contact you using a contact link (included with your post) that is substituted for your actual address. You must include a valid email address in this field. (return to form)
    Subject Subject may be edited for length and clarity. Subject lines should provide an indication of the content of your post. (return to form)
    Thread Related Link and Image Guidelines Thread Related Links posted at WOODWEB's Forums and Exchanges should point to locations that provide supporting information for the topic being discussed in the current message thread. The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not to serve as an advertising venue. A Thread Related Link that directs visitors to an area with inappropriate content will be removed. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links or images it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    Thread Related File Uploads Thread Related Files posted at WOODWEB's Forums and Exchanges should provide supporting information for the topic being discussed in the current message thread. Video Files: acceptable video formats are: .MOV .AVI .WMV .MPEG .MPG .MP4 (Image Upload Tips)   If you encounter any difficulty when uploading video files, E-mail WOODWEB for assistance. The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not to serve as an advertising venue. A Thread Related File that contains inappropriate content will be removed, and uploaded files that are not directly related to the message thread will be removed. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links, files, or images it deems inappropriate. (return to form)