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Growing black locust in MN

1/16/14       
Brian Heller Member

I am considering growing black locust in northern MN a little SW of Duluth. Is a anyone purposely growing black locust in MN? I know it is considered an invasive species but I think there could be a market for it, especially for it's rot resistance and the trend for green products. Anyone think this might work or am I playing with fire, risking uncontrolled spread of black locust?

1/17/14       #3: Growing black locust in MN ...
Gene Wengert-WoodDoc

I cannot comment about the spread of such a species. I assume that you do have information that says it will grow in your climate and soil.

However, it might be 70 years before you get a merchantable tree, as things do grow slowly in northern MN for sure. (Make sure you plant them very close to each other to limit branching. There would also be the risk of insects and disease.

Do you think anyone would want lumber from this species 75 years from now?

The heartwood is the highly resistant part of the tree, so that would cut into your sawing yields, raising your expenses. Plus, the wood itself is hard to saw, dull saws and other machine tools quickly. That would also raise your expenses.

1/18/14       #4: Growing black locust in MN ...
Brian Heller Member

Thanks for the advice. I am at the far end of the growing zones for Black Locust for sure. On of the reasons I was looking at Black Locust was that it is a fast growing tree. I thought I might have something salable in 30 to 40 years if not sooner. I wasn't thinking it would take 75. I am aware of problems with locust borers but I don't know how they spread and what other trees they infest. If they reach my stand I know there could be problems but if am fairly isolated I was hoping that my risk of infestation would be low.

Beside black locust's rapid growth rate I like the idea of a highly rot resistant wood that doesn't need chemicals applied. I like the idea of decks or outdoor furniture that could outlast the house they're with. And I figured that the way people have been going more green, black locust will eventually become a more prevalent building species. I figured the extra cost of milling and tooling could be made up in price because of its durability.

At 75 years until a profitable harvest I need to think about this more. Unless my kids follow in my footsteps they'll get a chunk of land full of trees that are taboo here and may have trouble selling.

1/18/14       #5: Growing black locust in MN ...
Gene Wengert-Wood Doc

Indeed, it seems good that no added chemicals are needed. But do you know what chemicals the tree has added to develop its natural resistance? They might be far worse in human risk. Not everything in nature is safe.

I know that black locust is fast growing in Virginia, but many species are in that climate and soil.ì

1/18/14       #6: Growing black locust in MN ...
Eric

I've sawed my share of Black Locust that grows around southwestern PA and it's a tough tree to get decent boards from or make money on.

As Gene mentioned, the heartwood is what you're after, and it does make good decking for exposed applications (trailers, truck beds, industrial decks). However, for residential applications I might hesitate since it tends to splinter easily. So a dock or an outdoor deck or any other place where barefoot traffic would be present wouldn't be a good application. Also, a lot of south american species have good water and rot resistance, are more plentiful and more attractive than Black Locust, and are therefore preferred by builders and contractors.

Locust isn't the best long-lived species, and tends to form bark pockets and open voids within the trunk. Many logs I've received have insects, or water cracks, or excessive branching or all three. I usually get them from tree services, so they are yard trees, since most loggers I know around here won't even pull locust up to the landings.

It is difficult to saw, so if you plan to do so, anticipate the extra costs. I have to change blades, sometimes as often as hourly when I saw it.

I took a quick look around your DNR / forest service and it looks like white oak grows well in many parts of Minnesota. If I were considering your plan, I might also look at White Oak as well. It is similar to Black Locust in that it has good water and rot resistance, is durable and strong, and has the added benefit of being more attractive when sawn. Black Locust is an orangy color when first sawn, but quickly ozidizes to a muted brown that shows defects readily.

White Oak is not nearly as harsh on the tools and sawblades. I rarely have any trouble selling White Oak. In fact, more often I have trouble getting ahold of the logs to saw.

As with Black Locust, White Oak needs competition to prevent sprawling branches, so if you plant it, do so densely, so that the trees grow up, rather than out.

Check out these links:
http://www.bachmans.com/Garden-Care/divHomePage.html?cnb=GardenCare&categoryCo
de=02&pageIndex=_pageIndexToken_oaks

http://www.minnesotaforests.com/resou
rces/pdfs/funactivities/treesofminnesota.pdf

Also search around for "white oak cultivation in Minnesota" for some more good resources.

It looks like White Oak is plentiful in parts of Minnesota already, so inexpensive sources of adapted seeds should be readily available.

Best of luck.

1/19/14       #7: Growing black locust in MN ...
Carl Hagstrom

Can't comment on the viability of locust in MN, but am
willing to offer some insights I've gleaned over the
year in NE PA. I would tend to agree with Eric about
the "gnarlyness" of the species, and with Gene about
all the added effort it might take to turn an area
into a viable locust log grove.

I have an area of about 5 acres on my property that
thirty years ago was pasture that was "going to seed"
in locust. I let it go, and kept the area relatively
clean around the trees, and as it's matured, I don't
see it becoming a viable saw log source - mainly for
the reason Gene mentions - locusts branch early and
often. Plus, they grow pretty squarely ....

I'd like to also add the just south of this area is
a mature climax type woods that is predominantly
hemlock. In the strip on the northern edge are some
75 to maybe even 100 year old locusts mixed in with
the hemlocks. These locusts have had to fight for
light their entire lives, and go maybe 40 to 50
feet tall without a branch - some of the straightest
locust I've seen. They're also only 15 to 18 inches
in diameter at the bottom.

We had a tornado type storm come through 2 summers
ago, and it lay ed a handful of these locusts over
in a big tangle. Just this past month, I finally got
around to untangling, and cut a few of these trees into
saw-able lengths (for a band mill). The growth rings
for the most part were l/16th or less apart - some of
the densest locust I've cut.

My friend with the band mill doesn't particularly
prefer sawing dry locust - it's really really hard,
and at the end of the day, it probably doesn't make
economic sense for me to saw up that little bit
of lumber, but if I don't, they'll likely end up
as firewood ... or maybe fence posts.

I mention all this because even those trees were
straight for locusts, they still have some
squiggle in them - maybe an in or two in an 8 foot
length - so, their relatively narrow diameter
combined with the squiggle - I don't see them
setting any board footage records when sawn.

Gene mentions planting close together, and if that
causes the slow growth I see in the spot I mention
above, it sure doesn't seem as though there'll be
a whole helluva lot of return on investment if
you go with locusts.

Don't get me wrong, locust is one of my favorite
tree species ... they're nitrogen fixing legumes,
honey from locust blossoms is some of the lightest
and tastiest there is, and what could be cooler
then a tree that produces boards that glow in the dark.
The lumber is luminescent ... I mentioned that to my
wife a while back, and she bought me a black light
for Christmas. I have a lot of fun demonstrating the
luminescence to folks.

Not sure if any of the above is helpful, Brian, but
I did want to share

1/20/14       #8: Growing black locust in MN ...
Brian Heller Member

Thanks for the posts. I was looking for a fast growing wood that I could plant and harvest in my lifetime. I knew that black locust was a tough wood but it sounds like it really isn't worth my effort to grow this for production. I have a section of land that has pretty bad soil so I might try to grow a little as a hobby and for the nitrogen fixing properties. I've read a lot of posts on various sites that talk about the properties of the tree and it sounded great, but from what you're saying I don't think there is any way I can make it economical. Time to come up with plan B.

Thanks for all the help.
Brian


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