Solid Wood Machining

You are not logged in. [ Login ] Why log in
(NOTE: Login is not required to post)

Supermax 2X25 drum sander just not aggressive?

2/1/17       
Matt

We have a fairly new (2 yrs) Supermax 2X25 drum sander that we've just never really been all that thrilled with, and I'm asking around to see what experience you guys are having with it. It is set up well (parallel platen/drums, rear drums are offset tighter just a touch, both drums make good contact).

Our planer has carbide cutters which we keep rotated properly to ensure good cuts. Even with that, we end up having to make multiple passes with the Supermax (100/120, or 120/150) to get full sanding across boards that are wider than 4-5".

If we try any more aggressive than that, we get burn marks and you can tell the machine is distinctly unhappy with the aggressive cut based on the way the paper/drums growl.

Dust collection is excellent, it's plumbed in to a 7.5hp bag-style and we only usually have two or three blast gates open at a time.

What is your experience with it?

I have to admit that I'm jaded. I used to lead a team that had a Powermatic 2X25 but that's a much beefier machine (and quite a bit more expensive). We used 100/120 on it, and one pass was all that was needed even on boards up to 8" wide. It even had far worse dust collection (small portable dust collector).

I know the ultimate would be a wide belt, but that's not an option at the moment. Our needs would be quite satisfactorily met if we were able to sand with the Supermax in one single pass.

We are sanding the basic maple, cherry, walnut, and oak for the most part.

2/1/17       #2: Supermax 2X25 drum sander just not ...
JR Rutter

Maybe you could convert the drums to velcro attachment for the abrasive. The extra cushioning might be what it takes.

I used to have a 2x36" Extrema drum sander that was a big upgrade from the Performax that I started with. Could run it 2x as fast and the rear drum was rubber for a better finish. Still had issues with the abrasive stretching and burning from time to time.

A wide belt is hard to beat...

2/1/17       #3: Supermax 2X25 drum sander just not ...
David R Sochar

The Supermax and Performax machines are subtle. 'Aggressive' is not a word that could ever be used with the lightweight drum sanders. If there was anything that even resembled agression, the wide belt sanders would go out of business.

Add up the time for the additional multiple passes and multiply that out for year's worth of labor at your shop rate. Chances are you are already paying for the wide belt, you just don't have it.

2/2/17       #4: Supermax 2X25 drum sander just not ...
Matt

Thanks guys, I'll see about some sort of cushioning option on the drums.

David, I know you're right about the cost of labor and multiple passes. We don't currently have a "huge" need for the drum sander, there are weeks that it doesn't even get touched.

I remember the 2X25 Powermatic, and it honestly almost had the aggression of a wide belt.... at least, compared to the old 50" wide belt that I have run before (again, years ago). Not quite that aggressive, I don't want to overstate it, but the Powermatic was surprisingly capable.

2/2/17       #5: Supermax 2X25 drum sander just not ...
David R Sochar Member

I understand that you may not use it all the time.
Let's do the math:

30 mins of labor saving every week at a shop rate of $80/hr = $40 per week
$40 x 52w = $2,080 per year
x 5 years payback = $10,400

The unknowns: How many other things will you use the sander for, if it is fast and efficient? How much will your business grow, making the sander a necessity? The 10,400 is in today's dollars. 5 years from now with avg inflation, that will be $12,050.

2/2/17       #6: Supermax 2X25 drum sander just not ...
JeffD

David's advice as usual is pretty spot on. I bought a Performax brand new about 15 years or so ago. I think I kept it for 8 months before tossing it out the door. Replaced with a new Powermatic dual drum which I will say was a very nice sander, probably the best of the drum sanders. Then I moved into a larger shop with 3 phase and bought an old beat up wide belt at auction....win!!!

If you really don't think you'll ever need a wide belt then at least get yourself a real drum sander. Right now your just wasting time trying to make money while fighting with a hobby machine. Any tweaks are going to provide marginal improvements at best. Sometimes....well most times, it's better to just bite the bullet and make the change than to continue down the same road over and over.

good luck,
JeffD

2/4/17       #7: Supermax 2X25 drum sander just not ...
rich c.

Cushioning the drum will give you stock that is not flat. Get a wide belt. Drum sander abrasive builds lots of heat because of the contact time on the wood. Belts run much cooler.

2/6/17       #8: Supermax 2X25 drum sander just not ...
Matt

I know you guys are right, ultimately the decision is not in my hands to make. I know one of the reasons we have not yet upgraded to a wide belt is that our current dust collector likely wouldn't cut it, so we'd be forking out the dough to upgrade both.

It would be a slam-dunk if we did hardwood more than a couple hours a week, we just have a few other higher priority machinery items we want to focus on first.

However, I am thankful for your help on here, you've helped confirm for me that this Supermax machine isn't really a good fit. I understand the limits of this sander better. This has been very helpful.

4/25/17       #9: Supermax 2X25 drum sander just not ...
Woodworker Member

I use very cheap old fashion glue powder that exists since 60 years ago.... mix with water... and mix with acid during application. It is 300-500 times cheaper than the available glue in the market...


Post a Response
  • Notify me of responses to this thread
  • Subscribe to email updates on this Forum
  • To receive email notification of additions to this forum thread,
    enter your name and email address, and then click the
    "Keep Me Posted" button below.

    Please Note: If you have posted a message or response,
    do not submit this request ... you are already signed up
    to receive notification!

    Your Name:
    E-Mail Address:
    Enter the correct numbers into the field below:
     

    Date of your Birth:



    Return to top of page

    Buy & Sell Exchanges | Forums | Galleries | Site Map

    FORUM GUIDELINES: Please review the guidelines below before posting at WOODWEB's Interactive Message Boards (return to top)

  • WOODWEB is a professional industrial woodworking site. Hobbyist and homeowner woodworking questions are inappropriate.
  • Messages should be kept reasonably short and on topic, relating to the focus of the forum. Responses should relate to the original question.
  • A valid email return address must be included with each message.
  • Advertising is inappropriate. The only exceptions are the Classified Ads Exchange, Machinery Exchange, Lumber Exchange, and Job Opportunities and Services Exchange. When posting listings in these areas, review the posting instructions carefully.
  • Subject lines may be edited for length and clarity.
  • "Cross posting" is not permitted. Choose the best forum for your question, and post your question at one forum only.
  • Messages requesting private responses will be removed - Forums are designed to provide information and assistance for all of our visitors. Private response requests are appropriate at WOODWEB's Exchanges and Job Opportunities and Services.
  • Messages that accuse businesses or individuals of alleged negative actions or behavior are inappropriate since WOODWEB is unable to verify or substantiate the claims.
  • Posts with the intent of soliciting answers to surveys are not appropriate. Contact WOODWEB for more information on initiating a survey.
  • Excessive forum participation by an individual upsets the balance of a healthy forum atmosphere. Individuals who excessively post responses containing marginal content will be considered repeat forum abusers.
  • Responses that initiate or support inappropriate and off-topic discussion of general politics detract from the professional woodworking focus of WOODWEB, and will be removed.
  • Participants are encouraged to use their real name when posting. Intentionally using another persons name is prohibited, and posts of this nature will be removed at WOODWEB's discretion.
  • Comments, questions, or criticisms regarding Forum policies should be directed to WOODWEB's Systems Administrator
    (return to top).

    Carefully review your message before clicking on the "Send Message" button - you will not be able to revise the message once it has been sent.

    You will be notified of responses to the message(s) you posted via email. Be sure to enter your email address correctly.

    WOODWEB's forums are a highly regarded resource for professional woodworkers. Messages and responses that are crafted in a professional and civil manner strengthen this resource. Messages that do not reflect a professional tone reduce the value of our forums.

    Messages are inappropriate when their content: is deemed libelous in nature or is based on rumor, fails to meet basic standards of decorum, contains blatant advertising or inappropriate emphasis on self promotion (return to top).

    Libel:   Posts which defame an individual or organization, or employ a tone which can be viewed as malicious in nature. Words, pictures, or cartoons which expose a person or organization to public hatred, shame, disgrace, or ridicule, or induce an ill opinion of a person or organization, are libelous.

    Improper Decorum:   Posts which are profane, inciting, disrespectful or uncivil in tone, or maliciously worded. This also includes the venting of unsubstantiated opinions. Such messages do little to illuminate a given topic, and often have the opposite effect. Constructive criticism is acceptable (return to top).

    Advertising:   The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not an advertising venue. Companies participating in a Forum discussion should provide specific answers to posted questions. WOODWEB suggests that businesses include an appropriately crafted signature in order to identify their company. A well meaning post that seems to be on-topic but contains a product reference may do your business more harm than good in the Forum environment. Forum users may perceive your references to specific products as unsolicited advertising (spam) and consciously avoid your web site or services. A well-crafted signature is an appropriate way to advertise your services that will not offend potential customers. Signatures should be limited to 4-6 lines, and may contain information that identifies the type of business you're in, your URL and email address (return to top).

    Repeated Forum Abuse: Forum participants who repeatedly fail to follow WOODWEB's Forum Guidelines may encounter difficulty when attempting to post messages.

    There are often situations when the original message asks for opinions: "What is the best widget for my type of shop?". To a certain extent, the person posting the message is responsible for including specific questions within the message. An open ended question (like the one above) invites responses that may read as sales pitches. WOODWEB suggests that companies responding to such a question provide detailed and substantive replies rather than responses that read as a one-sided product promotion. It has been WOODWEB's experience that substantive responses are held in higher regard by our readers (return to top).

    The staff of WOODWEB assume no responsibility for the accuracy, content, or outcome of any posting transmitted at WOODWEB's Message Boards. Participants should undertake the use of machinery, materials and methods discussed at WOODWEB's Message Boards after considerate evaluation, and at their own risk. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages it deems inappropriate. (return to top)


  • Forum Posting Help
    Your Name The name you enter in this field will be the name that appears with your post or response (return to form).
    Your Website Personal or business website links must point to the author's website. Inappropriate links will be removed without notice, and at WOODWEB's sole discretion. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    E-Mail Address Your e-mail address will not be publicly viewable. Forum participants will be able to contact you using a contact link (included with your post) that is substituted for your actual address. You must include a valid email address in this field. (return to form)
    Subject Subject may be edited for length and clarity. Subject lines should provide an indication of the content of your post. (return to form)
    Thread Related Link and Image Guidelines Thread Related Links posted at WOODWEB's Forums and Exchanges should point to locations that provide supporting information for the topic being discussed in the current message thread. The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not to serve as an advertising venue. A Thread Related Link that directs visitors to an area with inappropriate content will be removed. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links or images it deems inappropriate. (return to form)
    Thread Related File Uploads Thread Related Files posted at WOODWEB's Forums and Exchanges should provide supporting information for the topic being discussed in the current message thread. Video Files: acceptable video formats are: .MOV .AVI .WMV .MPEG .MPG .MP4 (Image Upload Tips)   If you encounter any difficulty when uploading video files, E-mail WOODWEB for assistance. The purpose of WOODWEB Forums is to provide answers, not to serve as an advertising venue. A Thread Related File that contains inappropriate content will be removed, and uploaded files that are not directly related to the message thread will be removed. WOODWEB reserves the right to delete any messages with links, files, or images it deems inappropriate. (return to form)